• Tapes

    From n2qfd@21:1/154 to All on Thu May 16 07:11:56 2024
    New experiment here,

    I was thinking about how I want direct control of my music again and returned to the idea of tapes. While not as convenient as digital media I've seen that there is a new generation of tape recorders out there with blue tooth for connectivity built in and interfacing for digital modes so that one could "rip" audio from any digital source.
    While cassettes have their drawbacks, I do think there's some level of control I might reassert with the medium in my music collection and my ability to sample new tracks that are quickly removed from digital platforms.

    The mixtape might be back, what the heck, the BBS is!

    N2QFD{Queen City BBS}:// "Does this need to be said? Does this need to be said by me? Does this need to be said by me right now?" - Craig Ferguson

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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to n2qfd on Thu May 16 06:53:00 2024
    n2qfd wrote to All <=-

    While cassettes have their drawbacks, I do think there's some level
    of control I might reassert with the medium in my music collection and
    my ability to sample new tracks that are quickly removed from digital platforms.

    I like older cars, and I'd go all-in on cassettes if I bought one -
    especially if I could create cassettes from MP3s.

    What I liked about cassettes, especially, was the sequential aspect of listening to music on them. It made more sense to rewind it, put it in,
    and listen to music in the order it was on the LP.

    People don't listen to CDs from start to finish anymore, nor are they
    designed to be listened to that way. What started off as an LP with 2
    sides and 40 minutes of music set in a specific flow has now become 70
    minutes of tracks assembled on a CD.

    With a cassette, I was more likely to listen to the whole album.



    "As I mentioned near the close of the last record, this record is
    another example of the Completion Backwards Principle. If you can
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  • From Nightfox@21:1/137 to n2qfd on Thu May 16 10:13:33 2024
    Re: Tapes
    By: n2qfd to All on Thu May 16 2024 07:11 am

    I was thinking about how I want direct control of my music again and returned to the idea of tapes. While not as convenient as digital media I've seen that there is a new generation of tape recorders out there with blue tooth for connectivity built in and interfacing for digital modes so that one could "rip" audio from any digital source.

    If you want to digitize music/audio from a cassette tape, I'm not sure that bluetooth would be the best way to connect it to your PC to do so. Maybe the audio quality from a cassette tape is such that it would be fine with a bluetooth connection, but I'd think a more direct connection (such as connecting to a line-in on your PC, or using a USB audio interface) would provide better quality. I have a cassette player that connects directly via USB that I bought for digitizing some cassettes I had, which I think worked fairly well. It was a fairly inexpensive device though, so there may be better versions of such devices that offer better quality.

    Nightfox
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  • From Nightfox@21:1/137 to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu May 16 10:16:49 2024
    Re: Re: Tapes
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to n2qfd on Thu May 16 2024 06:53 am

    People don't listen to CDs from start to finish anymore, nor are they designed to be listened to that way.

    They aren't? I always thought the songs on a CD were ordered the same way as they are on the casette and LP versions (though in some cases, I think they ordered the songs differently for each side of the record, compared with the song order on the cassette or CD). And sometimes I do listen to a whole album on CD, depending on the album. IMO there aren't many albums that I think every song is enjoyable enough to listen to the whole album, but if so, sometimes I'll listen to the whole CD. Other times, I do like to just listen to a couple songs from it and might skip around.

    Even with a record, it's easier to skip songs than it is on a cassette.

    Nightfox
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  • From k9zw@21:1/224 to n2qfd on Thu May 16 09:45:55 2024
    On 16 May 2024, n2qfd said the following...

    New experiment here,

    I was thinking about how I want direct control of my music again and returned to the idea of tapes. While not as convenient as digital media

    Has the print-through and degregation issues of tape been mitigated with the newer systems?

    There are other long standing issues with the audio headroom in consumer grade tapes available that would be my next set of questions.

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  • From n2qfd@21:1/154 to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu May 16 15:26:22 2024
    What I liked about cassettes, especially, was the sequential aspect of listening to music on them. It made more sense to rewind it, put it in, and listen to music in the order it was on the LP.

    Right, it wasn't just the individual songs that the artist was creating but the album if the label would let them.

    Queen's News of the World had All Dead All Dead which is a fantastic song that I don't think got the time it deserved. By the time we were kids there were best-ofs coming out and we were being told which songs were the best instead of finding them. Then the Napster to iTunes revolution made al la cart a thing. I used to make great mix CD's when Napster was alive. That transitioned into playlists. Something about the scale changed though and we didn't have to listen though it. It's like when you bicycle a route after you've been driving it for months and it just seems to take forever even if you know you're making a good speed. Your sense of scale has been re-written to something new. The Digital Age has brought us to a speed that makes cultivating patients difficult. In that rush we've lost something I think.

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  • From n2qfd@21:1/154 to Nightfox on Thu May 16 15:27:36 2024
    If you want to digitize music/audio from a cassette tape, I'm not sure that bluetooth would be the best way to connect it to your PC to do so. Maybe the audio quality from a cassette tape is such that it would be

    Thanks,

    I don't mean to connect via bluetooth for dubbing just that the potential to integrate into more modern systems for playback is now an option. I plan a cable hook up from a line out for dub.

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  • From n2qfd@21:1/154 to k9zw on Thu May 16 15:31:39 2024
    Has the print-through and degregation issues of tape been mitigated with the newer systems?


    Couldn't tell you,
    I'm not looking for digital quality though. I have a world of digital masters at my fingertips and I will be able to sample from that so I suspect all the same old issues plague the cassette tape however it's a a reasonable medium for portability and most importantly and ownership being 9/10 the law they can't steal my music back when I sync. Apple overwrote songs I paid for and took back tracks that were no longer available at the artists request the last time I sync'd my iPod. No more. I lost unique music I had on that device I added by ripping CD's on iTunes. I still have the CD's... I think... So I'll have to sample them again but I'm not using iTunes anymore.

    N2QFD{Queen City BBS}:// "Does this need to be said? Does this need to be said by me? Does this need to be said by me right now?" - Craig Ferguson

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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to k9zw on Fri May 17 07:42:00 2024
    k9zw wrote to n2qfd <=-

    Has the print-through and degregation issues of tape been mitigated
    with the newer systems?


    Tape was never about high fidelity, it was about being able to bring
    music with you - and later to share music. The glitches became part of
    the memory.

    I listen to MP3 versions of songs I had on tape, and they don't "feel"
    right without that one part where the tape crumpled when it ejected and
    the tape snagged, or where the tape did that mobius loop thing where
    you'd hear the B side in reverse where the tape was folded, or the
    skip/noise on the record I recorded it from.



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  • From Nightfox@21:1/137 to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri May 17 13:57:14 2024
    Re: Re: Tapes
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to k9zw on Fri May 17 2024 07:42 am

    I listen to MP3 versions of songs I had on tape, and they don't "feel" right without that one part where the tape crumpled when it ejected and the tape snagged, or where the tape did that mobius loop thing where you'd hear the B side in reverse where the tape was folded, or the skip/noise on the record I recorded it from.

    :)
    My dad bought an album on cassette tape when it was first released, and the particular tape he got had a defect where some of the audio was muffled for a second soon after the start of the first song. He never went to return/exchange his cassette tape though, so he just kept listening to it that way, so I got used to hearing that. Years later, I bought that album on CD for myself, and even though the audio was perfect and clean, at first it sounded a little odd to me without that audio defect in the first track.

    Nightfox
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  • From Ogg@21:4/106.21 to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri May 17 21:27:00 2024
    Hello pF!

    I listen to MP3 versions of songs I had on tape, and they
    don't "feel" right without that one part where the tape
    crumpled when it ejected and the tape snagged, or where
    the tape did that mobius loop thing where you'd hear the
    B side in reverse where the tape was folded, or the skip/
    noise on the record I recorded it from.

    I never had a self-mixed tape go bad like that. I tended to
    always play on good home equipment. Mind you, some of the
    orignal tapes of albums tended to wear quicker than the self-
    mix tapes using TDK or Maxell or Sony.


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  • From Avon@21:1/101 to Ogg on Sat May 18 19:36:46 2024
    On 17 May 2024 at 09:27p, Ogg pondered and said...

    I never had a self-mixed tape go bad like that. I tended to
    always play on good home equipment. Mind you, some of the
    orignal tapes of albums tended to wear quicker than the self-
    mix tapes using TDK or Maxell or Sony.

    I have a bunch of tapes here, some are in unopened shrink wrap packets of 5 that have yet to be used.. to be fair I don't use them much these days but it's nice to still have tapes and cassette playing gear here at home.

    Kerr Avon [Blake's 7] 'I'm not expendable, I'm not stupid and I'm not going' avon[at]bbs.nz | bbs.nz | fsxnet.nz

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  • From Ogg@21:4/106.21 to Avon on Sat May 18 09:12:00 2024
    Hello Avon!

    I have a bunch of tapes here, some are in unopened shrink
    wrap packets of 5 that have yet to be used.. to be fair I
    don't use them much these days but it's nice to still have
    tapes and cassette playing gear here at home.

    They are certainly an interesting momento to have around. I
    too have unopened sets and individual ones. I keep a few at my
    shop. Some people are willing to pay $5 a piece for the 60min
    versions, and $7 for the 90min.


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  • From Arelor@21:2/138 to poindexter FORTRAN on Sat May 18 11:28:21 2024
    Re: Re: Tapes
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to n2qfd on Thu May 16 2024 06:53 am

    People don't listen to CDs from start to finish anymore, nor are they designed to be listened to that way. What started off as an LP with 2
    sides and 40 minutes of music set in a specific flow has now become 70 minutes of tracks assembled on a CD.

    People making thematic albums disagree. Many metal releases only make sense if you listen to the album in order since the music tells a coherent story.

    I usually listen to a new album multiple times in a row. Later on I tend to cherry pick and select the tracks I like the most.
    --
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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to Avon on Sat May 18 07:23:00 2024
    Avon wrote to Ogg <=-

    I have a bunch of tapes here, some are in unopened shrink wrap packets
    of 5 that have yet to be used.. to be fair I don't use them much these days but it's nice to still have tapes and cassette playing gear here
    at home.

    I wonder if you should open them and rotate the spindles every so often?



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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to Arelor on Sat May 18 18:02:00 2024
    Arelor wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    People making thematic albums disagree. Many metal releases only make sense if you listen to the album in order since the music tells a
    coherent story.

    Queensryche, Operation: MindCrime.



    ... Change nothing and continue consistently
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  • From Ogg@21:4/106.21 to n2qfd on Sun May 19 13:02:00 2024
    Hello n2qfd!

    ** On Thursday 16.05.24 - 15:31, n2qfd wrote to k9zw:

    9/10 the law they can't steal my music back when I sync.
    Apple overwrote songs I paid for and took back tracks that
    were no longer available at the artists request the last
    time I sync'd my iPod. No more. I lost unique music I had
    on that device I added by ripping CD's on iTunes. I still
    have the CD's... I think... So I'll have to sample them
    again but I'm not using iTunes anymore.

    Wnen iTunes first offered that "replace your library with
    (better) iTunes versions) I was skeptical. Then, I started
    hearing stories from people that their favorite local copies
    went missing. But, did iTunes truly delete those previous
    copies? ..or was just the XML library code adjusted to point to
    the iCloud version?

    I'm not a regular iTunes Store user, but they do have the best
    interface for finding new releases. I've been the Spotify for
    several years, but it's hard to browse for new releases on that
    platform.


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  • From n2qfd@21:1/154 to Ogg on Sun May 19 14:00:28 2024
    Hey Ogg,

    went missing. But, did iTunes truly delete those previous
    copies? ..or was just the XML library code adjusted to point to
    the iCloud version?

    No they are gone. In some cases the bands broke up and I assume it came down to intellectual property disputes forcing a modified version be listed. In other cases they were never in the iTunes catalog so they were just scrubbed off my device. There's a fine print disclaimer when you sync that you might lose things and I did so I'm done.
    I played with tape again here but I found that the gear at a price point I think is reasonable is just not up to the level of quality we enjoyed when it was the only way to go. So, now I'm using Audacity to make my own digital tapes and storing them as MP3 on my server. My truck has a nice built in MP3 player anyhow and I can make albums up on memory sticks that you just need to put in the slot in the dash.
    I find I'll be listing to someone's mix on YouTube, while I work and at work when I'm in the office I can't have any of that for security reasons. We have no WiFi allowed on personal devices either. So, there I'm using an old smart phone that had a built in FM receiver and tuning into the college stations or I have to pack it in. On top of the work site restrictions I've got an hour drive one way across a radio poor landscape. So I think I'm finding modern applications of late 20c thinking to be my answer.

    N2QFD{Queen City BBS}:// "Does this need to be said? Does this need to be said by me? Does this need to be said by me right now?" - Craig Ferguson

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  • From Avon@21:1/101 to poindexter FORTRAN on Mon May 20 08:42:16 2024
    On 18 May 2024 at 07:23a, poindexter FORTRAN pondered and said...

    I have a bunch of tapes here, some are in unopened shrink wrap packet of 5 that have yet to be used.. to be fair I don't use them much thes days but it's nice to still have tapes and cassette playing gear here at home.

    I wonder if you should open them and rotate the spindles every so often?

    I figure they are going to either work or fail badly when I do ... so for now they look minty fresh... but looks can be deceiving.

    Kerr Avon [Blake's 7] 'I'm not expendable, I'm not stupid and I'm not going' avon[at]bbs.nz | bbs.nz | fsxnet.nz

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  • From Ogg@21:4/106.21 to n2qfd on Sun May 19 21:17:00 2024
    Hello n2qfd!

    No they are gone. In some cases the bands broke up and I
    assume it came down to intellectual property disputes
    forcing a modified version be listed. In other cases they
    were never in the iTunes catalog so they were just scrubbed
    off my device. There's a fine print disclaimer when you
    sync that you might lose things and I did so I'm done.

    Ah.. yes, I remember some of those details about replacement
    versions. And the warning about risk of losing existing music
    on the local device sounds familiar now. I'm glad I never
    opted for that "service". :D


    I played with tape again here but I found that the gear at
    a price point I think is reasonable is just not up to the
    level of quality we enjoyed when it was the only way to go.

    I'm sure there are still plenty of tape deck models
    manufactured today that are good quality. I see that Denon,
    Marantz, Sony, Yamaha, Tascam, Pioneer ..still produce cassette
    decks.

    My own dual-cassette machine has been sitting idle for over 20
    yrs.


    So, now I'm using Audacity to make my own digital tapes and
    storing them as MP3 on my server. My truck has a nice built
    in MP3 player anyhow and I can make albums up on memory
    sticks that you just need to put in the slot in the dash.

    I used a cigarette lighter USB charger to power a USB device
    that had an audio OUT that I could feed to the car audio
    system. Worked well for material that that could replace
    frequently like podcasts or a new album. But the management of
    that started to get tedious on one usb stick. Instead, I
    gravitated towards CD-RW discs for changeable .mp3 material.

    I also entertained using an iPod loaded with material. The iPod
    would be powered by a dual cigarette-lighter charger/cradle.
    That worked extremely well since the iPod had greater storage
    than a 700/800MB CD could provide.


    I find I'll be listing to someone's mix on YouTube, while I
    work and at work when I'm in the office I can't have any of
    that for security reasons. We have no WiFi allowed on
    personal devices either. So, there I'm using an old smart
    phone that had a built in FM receiver and tuning into the
    college stations or I have to pack it in.

    Sounds like the wifi in your work facility is not isolated for
    "guest" use.

    I note that most recent smartphones do not have built-in FM
    radios anymore. I still use a BlackBerry Q10 with FM, but it
    only works if there is a headset plugged into it - and, often
    the headset is never with me when I need it.


    On top of the work site restrictions I've got an hour drive
    one way across a radio poor landscape. So I think I'm
    finding modern applications of late 20c thinking to be my
    answer.

    I have areas along my commute that have poor or undesireable
    radio station options too. So, invehicle sources from CD, CD-
    RW and .mp3 from a smartphone satisfy that gap well.


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  • From n2qfd@21:1/154 to Ogg on Mon May 20 07:11:38 2024
    Sounds like the wifi in your work facility is not isolated for
    "guest" use.

    Yeah Ogg, they don't want us using bandwidth either. It's a strange thing. I have worked on and off in civil engineering inside the energy industry for years now and I've never been with an outfit that's so cash poor. It's just bad management and deregulation. When the Clinton years deregulation of electricity reached the Regan years of deregulated gas... well this is what's come of it. We have New York in our name but we're under a regional division that's under an international company now and they care very little for the stepchild of a stepchild.


    I note that most recent smartphones do not have built-in FM
    radios anymore. I still use a BlackBerry Q10 with FM, but it
    only works if there is a headset plugged into it - and, often
    the headset is never with me when I need it.

    Here I'm using Nokia's clone of that blackberry which I loved but they were still using the Oki operating system and stopped support for it just before selling to Microsoft who killed the brand. Nokia bought itself back but they're either very basic phones or touch screens now. Shame really, it was a great tool. I've read that many smart phones can receive FM but the carriers lock out the feature. It's almost like they'd rather you use the data and force you into storage issues with carried media or using streaming services than relying on the local broadcast...

    N2QFD

    N2QFD{Queen City BBS}:// "Does this need to be said? Does this need to be said by me? Does this need to be said by me right now?" - Craig Ferguson

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  • From Avon@21:1/101 to All on Thu May 23 19:59:26 2024
    On 20 May 2024 at 08:42a, Avon pondered and said...

    I wonder if you should open them and rotate the spindles every so oft

    I figure they are going to either work or fail badly when I do ... so
    for now they look minty fresh... but looks can be deceiving.

    As an aside I saw a clip on YouTube tonight, it was a CBS news story about the resurgence of cassette tape sales in the USA, big upswing in sales to Gen Z since 2015... it was about 5 mins long and an interest watch.

    Kerr Avon [Blake's 7] 'I'm not expendable, I'm not stupid and I'm not going' avon[at]bbs.nz | bbs.nz | fsxnet.nz

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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to Avon on Thu May 23 07:21:00 2024
    Avon wrote to All <=-

    As an aside I saw a clip on YouTube tonight, it was a CBS news story
    about the resurgence of cassette tape sales in the USA, big upswing in sales to Gen Z since 2015... it was about 5 mins long and an interest watch.

    The last cassette manufacturer closed down a couple of years ago, now
    they're going to use scarcity and demand to drive the price of tapes up.
    Smart. Time to stock up and start an eBay store.

    They did the same thing with film cameras and film, as soon as Kodak
    stopped production of film.

    We're rats in marketer's mazes.



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  • From Accession@21:1/200 to Avon on Thu May 23 13:48:28 2024
    Hello Avon,

    On Thu, 23 May 2024 19:59:26 +1200, you wrote to All:

    As an aside I saw a clip on YouTube tonight, it was a CBS news story about the resurgence of cassette tape sales in the USA, big upswing in sales to Gen Z since 2015... it was about 5 mins long and an interest watch.

    Really? I'm in the USA, and haven't seen a cassette tape since I was a kid. :)

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... Take my advice, I don't use it anyway.
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  • From Nightfox@21:1/137 to Accession on Thu May 23 13:37:53 2024
    Re: Tapes
    By: Accession to Avon on Thu May 23 2024 01:48 pm

    As an aside I saw a clip on YouTube tonight, it was a CBS news story
    about the resurgence of cassette tape sales in the USA, big upswing in
    sales to Gen Z since 2015... it was about 5 mins long and an interest
    watch.

    Really? I'm in the USA, and haven't seen a cassette tape since I was a kid. :)

    A couple years ago, Amazon sent me something by mistake which must have been someone else's order (but was addressed to me), and it was a cassette tape of a fairly recent album that an independent artist had released. So apparently there is indeed some recent demand for cassette tapes.

    Nightfox
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  • From Avon@21:1/101 to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri May 24 13:16:51 2024
    On 23 May 2024 at 07:21a, poindexter FORTRAN pondered and said...

    The last cassette manufacturer closed down a couple of years ago, now they're going to use scarcity and demand to drive the price of tapes up. Smart. Time to stock up and start an eBay store.

    The clip I watched gave the impression there were USA firms still making them and were doing better now for sales than in the 90s

    Here's the link - sorry about the long manky URL

    https://youtu.be/Vr2_CUAldjQ?si=pNa87DiHj2lNlllj

    Kerr Avon [Blake's 7] 'I'm not expendable, I'm not stupid and I'm not going' avon[at]bbs.nz | bbs.nz | fsxnet.nz

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  • From Accession@21:1/200 to Nightfox on Thu May 23 21:32:36 2024
    Hello Nightfox,

    On Thu, 23 May 2024 13:37:52 -0700, you wrote to me:

    Really? I'm in the USA, and haven't seen a cassette tape since I was a
    kid. :)

    A couple years ago, Amazon sent me something by mistake which must have been someone else's order (but was addressed to me), and it was a cassette tape of a fairly recent album that an independent artist had released. So apparently there is indeed some recent demand for cassette tapes.

    That's cool, I guess. I just haven't seen or had one (or anything to actually play it on) in over a quarter of a century. Honestly, I don't really have an urge to, either. I remember the difference in sound quality when we moved on to CDs. Or winding up a cassette tape that got murdered/unraveled by the cassette player, etc. No thanks. :)

    Regards,
    Nick

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  • From Blue White@21:4/134 to Accession on Fri May 24 08:18:10 2024
    As an aside I saw a clip on YouTube tonight, it was a CBS news
    story about
    the resurgence of cassette tape sales in the USA, big upswing in
    sales to
    Gen Z since 2015... it was about 5 mins long and an interest
    watch.

    Really? I'm in the USA, and haven't seen a cassette tape since I was a
    kid. :)

    I wonder if it is a nostalgia thing where the Gen Z kids find their
    parents old cassettes & players and then start wanting some of their own.

    In the late 1980s, I for a brief while got back into 8-tracks. Not so
    much because I thought they were better (by any means!) but because I
    still my parents' working player, that I could plug into my stereo, and
    could find the tapes at garage sales, flea markets, etc., for 25-50 cents
    vs. $12-15 for the CD.

    More recently, I have purchased old albums for between 50 cents and $2
    from a local flea market store vs. more expensive CDs. Then again, they
    are mostly CDs I'd not gone looking for otherwise so I probably wasn't
    saving as much $$$ as I thought. ;)


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  • From Accession@21:1/200 to Blue White on Fri May 24 09:42:04 2024
    Hello Blue,

    On Fri, 24 May 2024 08:18:10 -0500, you wrote to me:

    I wonder if it is a nostalgia thing where the Gen Z kids find their parents old cassettes & players and then start wanting some of their own.

    I'm sure it is. That goes for records and 8-tracks and all that, too. Heck, some people even miss the crackling sound of a record.

    In the late 1980s, I for a brief while got back into 8-tracks. Not so much because I thought they were better (by any means!) but because I still my parents' working player, that I could plug into my stereo, and could find the tapes at garage sales, flea markets, etc., for 25-50 cents vs. $12-15 for the CD.

    I suppose it would be different if there was something around here that played any of the old mediums. Nostalgia might kick in at that point, but there has been nothing around for so long, and none of us care to go out of our way to buy anything just to play a couple things, be like "cool" and completely forget about it again. :)

    More recently, I have purchased old albums for between 50 cents and $2 from a local flea market store vs. more expensive CDs. Then again, they are mostly CDs I'd not gone looking for otherwise so I probably wasn't saving as much $$$ as I thought. ;)

    Sounds about right. At that point it probably becomes more of an impulse buy than anything. I can attest I've been guilty of that many times, just not in retro music playback, is all.

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... Take my advice, I don't use it anyway.
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  • From Nightfox@21:1/137 to Accession on Fri May 24 09:29:52 2024
    Re: Tapes
    By: Accession to Nightfox on Thu May 23 2024 09:32 pm

    That's cool, I guess. I just haven't seen or had one (or anything to actually play it on) in over a quarter of a century. Honestly, I don't really have an urge to, either. I remember the difference in sound quality when we moved on to CDs. Or winding up a cassette tape that got murdered/unraveled by the cassette player, etc. No thanks. :)

    Yeah, I don't really have an urge to either, for the same reasons. But one thing I'm somewhat interested in is digitizing rare music that was available on cassette but not made available on newer media. I have a few such cassettes, and several years ago, I bought a cassette deck (which looks like a walkman) with a USB interface, for digitizing cassette tapes. I recorded a few that I have, then cleaned the audio up a bit, and split them into the separate audio tracks.

    Nightfox
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  • From Accession@21:1/200 to Nightfox on Fri May 24 11:51:50 2024
    Hello Nightfox,

    On Fri, 24 May 2024 09:29:52 -0700, you wrote to me:

    Yeah, I don't really have an urge to either, for the same reasons. But one thing I'm somewhat interested in is digitizing rare music that was available on cassette but not made available on newer media. I have a few such cassettes, and several years ago, I bought a cassette deck (which looks like a walkman) with a USB interface, for digitizing cassette tapes. I recorded a few that I have, then cleaned the audio up a bit, and split them into the separate audio tracks.

    Is there really that much that was released on cassette and *not* re-released on CD over the years though? Or are you just not willing to spend the money on said CDs when you can just do it yourself?

    Hell, I don't even buy CDs any more. I want to listen to music I just stream it. Much less clutter. :)

    Regards,
    Nick

    ... Take my advice, I don't use it anyway.
    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20240309
    * Origin: _thePharcyde distribution system (Wisconsin) (21:1/200)
  • From Nightfox@21:1/137 to Accession on Fri May 24 10:18:55 2024
    Re: Tapes
    By: Accession to Nightfox on Fri May 24 2024 11:51 am

    Is there really that much that was released on cassette and *not* re-released on CD over the years though? Or are you just not willing to spend the money on said CDs when you can just do it yourself?

    If they were available on CD, I'd buy them. It's not common, but there are some things that were only released on cassette tape. The ones I have, there's a company called Roland that makes music synthesizers, and in the late 70s to the mid 80s, they had contests where people could record their own synthesizer music and send in their songs, and Roland would choose winners, and they'd release the winners' music on cassette tape. These cassettes seem to be fairly rare, and as far as I know, they never released them on CD.

    For example:
    https://tinyurl.com/ycyk7uwb
    Full URL: https://allnightflightrecords.com/products/various-rolands-6th-annual-synthesiz er-tape-contest-the-winners-pieces

    Hell, I don't even buy CDs any more. I want to listen to music I just stream it. Much less clutter. :)

    Streaming music is one thing I don't really like to do.. I often listen to music in my car, and there are a lot of areas where there's no signal (especially if I'm on a long road trip), and I wouldn't want my music cutting out. I know some streaming services let you save music locally though, but if it's music I really like, I generally prefer to buy a copy and have my own that I can play anywhere. I don't directly play CDs anymore, but I'll rip them to FLAC and MP3. I have the MP3s on my phone, as well as on a USB flash drive that I can play in my car. I also have them on my media server, so I could stream it if I wanted to.. And I have my CDs in a closet so they aren't making clutter elsewhere.

    Sometimes I'll buy music that's available for download too, if it's available in a DRM-free format.

    Nightfox
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  • From Blue White@21:4/134 to Accession on Mon May 27 10:43:10 2024
    More recently, I have purchased old albums for between 50 cents
    and $2
    from a local flea market store vs. more expensive CDs. Then
    again, they
    are mostly CDs I'd not gone looking for otherwise so I probably
    wasn't
    saving as much $$$ as I thought. ;)

    Sounds about right. At that point it probably becomes more of an
    impulse buy than anything. I can attest I've been guilty of that many
    times, just not in retro music playback, is all.


    Yes, that was always on impulse. I would go to the flea mkt store on
    purpose, but whatever I found was always by accident. :D



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  • From Blue White@21:4/134 to Accession on Mon May 27 10:47:13 2024
    Is there really that much that was released on cassette and *not* re-released on CD over the years though? Or are you just not willing
    to spend the money on said CDs when you can just do it yourself?


    I cannot say for sure that they were not released on CD at all, but I
    have found that some albums (and not necessarily even obscure ones) are difficult to buy now *new* on CD. You usually have to find them used.

    I cannot remember which cassettes now (been a long time) but back when I
    got my first CD player (in 1988 or 89) there were some cassettes that I
    really wanted to replace with CDs and I was not able to find at that time.



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  • From hollowone@21:2/150 to n2qfd on Sun Nov 3 06:40:28 2024
    I was thinking about how I want direct control of my music again and

    If control over the way you listen to the music, then particular medium holding the audio data matters not.

    I had the same thoughts years ago. I started collecting LPs again as one of the remedies. I also have few tapes and also few empty tapes to record something on them, but I don't over use that medium. It'd be fun if I had Walkman to come back to childhood memories of how I listen to the music while being remote to my home audio systems, but the only remote location I have to listen to anything audio is my car and I have it sorted there differently as well.

    Basically two things. LPs stay, they are cool way to listen to the music and perfect reason to receive them as presents for any occasion, easy shot for my friends and family and my collection grows.

    Then I came back to the number of CDs I already have and digitalized them all into FLAC. I keep downloading albums for offline use than anything streaming (legal or illegal, doesn't matter technically doesn't matter).

    I have them all on my NAS for local audio and share with audio devices remotely via iPhone. I also download what I fancy to have in my car as full albums to the device, basically treating my iPhone as if it was iPod again.

    I use VOX on my computer, Winamp on my iPhone and listen to all the albums I have in an old fashioned way, from 1st to last tune as it was designed originally.

    I use Elby also to present my audio like if I had Spotify but with private collection and no plan and listen from my TV with another set of audio speakers as alternative to the set in a room where I have my LP, CD, Tape Players + Bluetooth for remote playback.

    I try to avoid Spotify and YT for any recommendation driven playback. I rather browse through bestalbumoftheyear.com or similar sites (metacritic too) to figure out what I think I should discover next.

    That has cured my random approach to music completely.

    -h1

    ... Xerox Alto was the thing. Anything after we use is just a mere copy.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: 2o for beeRS>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)
  • From hollowone@21:2/150 to Nightfox on Sun Nov 3 06:46:24 2024
    They aren't? I always thought the songs on a CD were ordered the same
    way as they are on the casette and LP versions (though in some cases, I think they ordered the songs differently for each side of the record,

    I only heard that when recorded they are much more louder and lose all the audiowave dynamics comparing to the past. I usually normalize against loudness when I rip CDs.

    -h1

    ... Xerox Alto was the thing. Anything after we use is just a mere copy.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: 2o for beeRS>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)
  • From hollowone@21:2/150 to Ogg on Sun Nov 3 08:46:48 2024
    Wnen iTunes first offered that "replace your library with
    (better) iTunes versions) I was skeptical. Then, I started
    hearing stories from people that their favorite local copies
    went missing. But, did iTunes truly delete those previous
    copies? ..or was just the XML library code adjusted to point to
    the iCloud version?

    I lost access to a few albums I purchased via iTunes in the past. I mean, same account and they are gone. Luckily those were the times (I dunno how is it today with iMusic) that when purchased I could have my own offline Mp3 copy, which I maintained and still use for those albums.

    Another warning for purchasing audio online.. unless you have ability to have un-DRMed version to be downloaded for offline maintenance, then there is no buy from my side.

    -h1

    ... Xerox Alto was the thing. Anything after we use is just a mere copy.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: 2o for beeRS>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)
  • From hollowone@21:2/150 to Ogg on Sun Nov 3 08:48:38 2024
    I also entertained using an iPod loaded with material. The iPod
    would be powered by a dual cigarette-lighter charger/cradle.
    That worked extremely well since the iPod had greater storage
    than a 700/800MB CD could provide.

    And that was ideal solution for me, nothing else needed to be invented in the category.

    -h1

    ... Xerox Alto was the thing. Anything after we use is just a mere copy.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: 2o for beeRS>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)
  • From hollowone@21:2/150 to Blue White on Sun Nov 3 08:55:18 2024
    In the late 1980s, I for a brief while got back into 8-tracks. Not so much because I thought they were better (by any means!) but because I still my parents' working player, that I could plug into my stereo, and could find the tapes at garage sales, flea markets, etc., for 25-50 cents vs. $12-15 for the CD.

    I remember when I finally could afford a lot of albums as a single romantic purchase and entering stores like Amoeba in Hollywood/LA and going nuts..

    those were the times...

    -h1

    ... Xerox Alto was the thing. Anything after we use is just a mere copy.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2024/05/29 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: 2o for beeRS>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)
  • From hollowone@21:2/150 to Nightfox on Sun Nov 3 09:00:29 2024
    Streaming music is one thing I don't really like to do.. I often listen to music in my car, and there are a lot of areas where there's no signal (especially if I'm on a long road trip), and I wouldn't want my music cutting out. I know some streaming services let you save music locally though, but if it's music I really like, I generally prefer to buy a
    copy and have my own that I can play anywhere. I don't directly play
    CDs anymore, but I'll rip them to FLAC and MP3. I have the MP3s on my phone, as well as on a USB flash drive that I can play in my car. I also have them on my media server, so I could stream it if I wanted to.. And
    I have my CDs in a closet so they aren't making clutter elsewhere.

    That's exactly my scenario too (as described in some previous post here).

    -h1

    ... Xerox Alto was the thing. Anything after we use is just a mere copy.

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    * Origin: 2o for beeRS>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to hollowone on Sun Nov 3 08:14:00 2024
    hollowone wrote to n2qfd <=-


    Then I came back to the number of CDs I already have and digitalized
    them all into FLAC. I keep downloading albums for offline use than anything streaming (legal or illegal, doesn't matter technically
    doesn't matter).

    My hearing is getting worse, MP3s at 192kbps seems fine. :(

    I use VOX on my computer, Winamp on my iPhone and listen to all the
    albums I have in an old fashioned way, from 1st to last tune as it was designed originally.

    THIS. My kids don't appreciate the flow of listening to an LP the way we
    did. LPs were around 40 minutes and bands typically seem to fill CDs
    nowadays with 10+ songs, don't think they'd have the same flow as
    listening to a Pink Floyd, Marillion, or other album designed for
    listening straight through.

    My first record listened thusly? Moving Pictures, by Rush. Duke, by
    Genesis.


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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to hollowone on Sun Nov 3 08:15:00 2024
    hollowone wrote to Nightfox <=-

    They aren't? I always thought the songs on a CD were ordered the same
    way as they are on the casette and LP versions (though in some cases, I think they ordered the songs differently for each side of the record,

    I only heard that when recorded they are much more louder and lose all
    the audiowave dynamics comparing to the past. I usually normalize
    against loudness when I rip CDs.

    Most cassettes had some dead tape on one side, usually the end of side 2
    - that way you could play the tape and flip it over without having to
    fast forward.



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  • From Arelor@21:2/138 to hollowone on Sun Nov 3 17:33:32 2024
    Re: Re: itunes
    By: hollowone to Ogg on Sun Nov 03 2024 08:46 am

    Another warning for purchasing audio online.. unless you have ability to have un-DRMed version to be downloaded for offline maintenance, then there is no buy from my side.

    This is also my policy, and not only for audio.

    I recently wrote an article about videogame preservation and it made me realize some of the biggest obstacles to running legitimate copies of videogames from 20 years ago were copy-protection mechanisms. Some games were distributed on CDs with deliberatedly bad sectors, stuff like that. Worst offenders were the ones that had the data recorded according to a certain topography and the game would check you had a CD with the correct topography in the tray. Fast forward 15 years and modern computers can't cope with those mechanisms so the game does not play.




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  • From Nightfox@21:1/137 to poindexter FORTRAN on Sun Nov 3 15:39:43 2024
    Re: Re: Tapes
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to hollowone on Sun Nov 03 2024 08:14 am

    My hearing is getting worse, MP3s at 192kbps seems fine. :(

    When I started using MP3s in 1997 or 1998, 128kbps was common, and honestly that has always sounded fine to me. But I've since converted my library (ripped from my CDs) to variable bitrate MP3.

    My first record listened thusly? Moving Pictures, by Rush.

    Good album. :)

    Nightfox
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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to hollowone on Sun Nov 3 21:30:08 2024
    Re: Re: Tapes
    By: hollowone to Blue White on Sun Nov 03 2024 08:55 am

    In the late 1980s, I for a brief while got back into 8-tracks. Not so
    much
    because I thought they were better (by any means!) but because I still my
    parents' working player, that I could plug into my stereo, and could find
    the tapes at garage sales, flea markets, etc., for 25-50 cents vs. $12-15
    for the CD.


    And a car stereo with 8-track was virtually theft-proof. I was driving a Fiat convertible back then. :)
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